tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post110070241709520518..comments2024-03-28T18:17:00.135-05:00Comments on Computational Complexity: How about Informaticians?Lance Fortnowhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06752030912874378610noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1101101175960243462004-11-21T23:26:00.000-06:002004-11-21T23:26:00.000-06:00Emil Post, who proved Godel's incompleteness theor...Emil Post, who proved Godel's incompleteness theorem and Turing's undecidability a decade before either of them was also a school teacher. Maybe Molly can find for us a proof of P \neq NP tucked away in the drawer of this computer scientist. ;-)<br /><br />More seriously, I agree with the naming issue---I usually use "computer science researcher" often qualified with "really an applied mathematician"... etc., for lack of a better term. Theoretical computer scientist maybe appropriate for the FOCS/STOC community, but obviously does not cover the whole CS community.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100929748725531622004-11-19T23:49:00.000-06:002004-11-19T23:49:00.000-06:00This might be Peter Naur's influence - he thought ...This might be Peter Naur's influence - he thought "dataology" was the ideal term; it caught on in some Scandinavian countries. An interesting fellow - it's worth googling him.<br /><br />"Ordinateur" means "counter" or "enumerator" (in English, think "ordinals"), which is a more precise term than "computer", imho.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100852375282763832004-11-19T02:19:00.000-06:002004-11-19T02:19:00.000-06:00In french, computer scientists (or people related ...In french, computer scientists (or people related to computers in any way) are called informaticians. I dont think "informaticians" is a good choice word. <br />By the way, the situation is really worse in french, since a computer is not even called a computer, but an "ordinateur" (someone please give me the translation and the reason for this terminology!). <br /><br />Change of terminology in english could perhaps be wisely adapted to french <br />and improve the poor french terminology, which I have felt some concern for more then once, but this would require sopmething else then "informatician"!...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100839756305092282004-11-18T22:49:00.000-06:002004-11-18T22:49:00.000-06:00How about "Computational Sciences?" similar to "Ea...How about "Computational Sciences?" similar to "Earth Sciences" or "Health Sciences"?<br /><br />This would emphasize that we are concerned with all aspects of computation not just with physical computers.<br /><br />Still, the problem of definition is inherent to the field, computer science is about a bunch of loosely related ideas and not one huge theoretical framework.<br /><br />In this aspect, it is more like combinatorics than topology for example.<br /><br />Tim Gowers had a great essay talking a little about this:<br />http://www.dpmms.cam.ac.uk/~wtg10/2cultures.ps<br /><br />In the end I don't think it is that big a deal.<br /><br />As long as we have students, funding and most importantly good problems to work on, it doesn't matter that much how we define ourselves.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100779156261301832004-11-18T05:59:00.000-06:002004-11-18T05:59:00.000-06:00But how do you know that her teacher isn't a compu...But how do you know that her teacher isn't a computer scientist? Having a Ph.D or a position as a professor at a University are not the only ways that you can be a scientist. Many "scientists" never had a Ph.D nor a position at a University. Archimedes certainly didn't, neither did Einstein initially (he was a patent clerk), nor Pierre de Fermat (who was a lawyer, I think) nor Foucault (who was an engineer).<br /><br />Your daughter's teacher could very well be doing research in computer science. See news about Carolyn Dean as an example of a mere lecturer cracking the Jacobian conjecture in mathematics at http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/blog/archives/000105.html.<br /><br />Besides I have heard the claim that mathematics (of which I guess computer science is a branch of) is not a "science" so perhaps your field should be called Algorithmics?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100731208265599392004-11-17T16:40:00.000-06:002004-11-17T16:40:00.000-06:00When I've first read the term "informatician", my ...When I've first read the term "informatician", my gut reaction was on the lines of "but I am not really that, I would say I'm more of an algorithmician"... But then again, other people reading this would make the same claim with the two terms permuted.<br /><br />So - is there a possibility of a word describing the entirety of our discipline? And is the lack of one a predictor of a future split?<br /><br /> - Eldar.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100714625350566952004-11-17T12:03:00.000-06:002004-11-17T12:03:00.000-06:00Maybe we should call ourselves applied mathematici...Maybe we should call ourselves applied mathematicians? It's virtually hopeless that people will know what I mean when I say I'm a computer science student. The most common reaction is "oh, so you build computers?"Macneil Shonlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16382866616548432101noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100706202594244452004-11-17T09:43:00.000-06:002004-11-17T09:43:00.000-06:00To some extent, the word "scientist" is used for
...To some extent, the word "scientist" is used for <br />people who do "advanced" study in some<br />particular field of science (or engineering). <br />An undergraduate degree in a particular field<br />does not usually qualify one to claim "advanced" <br />knowledge and hece undergrad math majors don't <br />usually call themseleves mathematicians. <br />Of course there are exceptions to this loose<br />interpretation but, in my opinion, <br />by and large a scientist has<br />to be pursuing the advancement of science, not<br />simply have a basic degree in that area. <br /><br />By that same token, not all scientists <br />are technologists. It is snobbery to claim<br />superiority of one over the other but the<br />words should convey as accurately as possible<br />the main preoccupation of the person.<br /><br />I think there is some difficulty with<br />computer "science" because several of<br />the first departments started out of <br />math and it is only later that they became<br />part of engineering disciplines.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100704738045882702004-11-17T09:18:00.000-06:002004-11-17T09:18:00.000-06:00'informatician' makes it sound like 'mortician' :)...'informatician' makes it sound like 'mortician' :)Suresh Venkatasubramanianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15898357513326041822noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3722233.post-1100703791736083602004-11-17T09:03:00.000-06:002004-11-17T09:03:00.000-06:00I'm not sure I understood this post: is the point ...I'm not sure I understood this post: is the point that only people who do research can call themselves<br />"computer scientists"? Why? Don't people with (say) an undergraduate degree in physics call themselves "physicists"?<br /> <br />Or maybe this goes back to the question of whether "computer science" as taught at the undergraduate level<br />is really a "science", or might better be called "information technology".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com